FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS ABOUT GRAMPIAN 30


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I will be keeping an eye on the other Grampian Forums and adding here any interesting information regarding repair and maintenance from these other sites plus any information you want to provide on "fixes" you have made to your Grampian 30 that others might find of interest. Please contact the Webmaster with any suggestions. 

  1. How to treat play in your rudder

  2. Hole in G30 Keel

  3. Floor Replacement

  4. Deck Drains

  5. Headroom

  6. Forestay Fitting Failure

  7. Window Replacement


     

     

  1.     How to treat play in your rudder

Last fall I dropped my rudder as I had some play to be addressed. The rudder is held in place by a pin that goes through the stock and swivels on a plate that simply sits on the cockpit floor.  After 28 years of use the pin was bent and worn flat on each end where it rubbed on the floor plate and the floor plate was dished.

I have now had made a new and improved system that the maker is offering to any other G 30 owners, or other size if suitable, at a very reasonable cost.

This modification may require some minor surgery on top of the rudder to ensure that it lifts high enough to enable the pin to engage in the hole in the rudder stock due to the slightly increased thickness of the 2 plates.

I attach a photograph that shows both the old worn out system and the new system waiting to be installed.

 Anyone interested should contact Gord Martin at gordmartin@look.ca  - it seems that the boats do differ in certain aspects such as the distance between the pin hole in the rudder stock and the shoulder where the stock is reduced in diameter so Gord will need specific measurements on any orders so communication with him before manufacture is essential (Peter Davidson)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  1. Hole in G30 Keel

        Problem:

I am considering buying a G30. This particular boat has a rectangular area just below where the keel is joined to the hull that appears to be filled with some kind of filler that shrunk over time. The broker tells me that Grampian had plans to make a deep bilge at one point but they never followed through with the idea so in the factory they filled that hole with Styrofoam and filler. This deteriorated over time and at some point someone tried to fill the whole with some kind of filler but did a bad job at it.

My question is: does this ring true? Is that something I should be concerned about? What is the best to way to make repairs?

    Suggestions:

My boat deteriorated in somewhat the same way and I consulted with Gill Bibby who was a production supervisor for Grampian and who supervised all the G30 line (among others). In my case the cavity was filled by a rectangular plastic box filled with foam. Gill indicated that the initial mold for the keel resulted in a keel that was a bit too heavy. As a simple fix and to keep the weight low, the keel manufacturer was instructed to just put a plug in the mold to create the hole. You may wish to confirm this with Gill by contacting him at http://www.gillbibbyboatbuilding.com/ and ask for his advice. He was very helpful when I went to visit him some years ago.

In my case, I just filled the box with closed cell foam and re-faired the area. The deterioration appeared to be due to repeated freeze-thaw cycles after the box took on water.

Can you describe the process you used to fill the hole in some detail?

Unfortunately I can't relate the details. It's been a few years and I had a fiber glass guy do it for me.   I think  the cavity was filled by a plastic box which in turn was filled with foam. But the box was no longer sealed, allowing water in. As I recall, he drained as much water as possible, let it dry for a while, injected closed-cell foam and then glassed and faired over the lot.

As for filling the hole (without a box already in place), perhaps you can arrange plywood 'plates' for each side of the keel with small holes to inject foam. These can be held in place with thru-bolts (threaded rod) thru the cavity. Then, when the foam has set up, remove the plates and thru-bolts and fill the bolt holes with more foam. Then proceed with glass and fairing from there. I'm not sure if a barrier or release agent on the bottom of the hull would be advisable or not. You probably don't want the foam to stick to the hull if/when the hull and keel ever need to be separated. (Bob Wieber)

Upon striping the bottom of the boat for refinishing, I discovered the source of water that seeped out of the keel each winter (the hole).  The hole in my keel had been covered with fiberglass and Bondo, and was filled with a pieces of foam and seemly anything else Grampian had lying around, that were saturated with water.  I repaired the problem by completely removing the Bondo and foam from the hole.  Then made a form on each side from some thin paneling and filled the hole with a closed-cell foam (won't absorb water).  Once the foam dried, I removed the forms and sanded it smooth to the shape of the keel.  Then covered the foam with fiberglass and micro-balloons to completely smooth things out.   After this repair, I complete the refinishing project with Interprotect 2000E followed by VC17m.

Regarding cleaning out the old stuff in the hole.... go ahead and remove the plastic box (if there is one) and all contents of the hole.  You should be left with a hole that is the bare lead keel only.  Clean it completely out, don't try to reuse any of the junk Grampian put into the keel.  Then form a mold to inject the closed-cell foam using 1/8 plywood.  Secure the plywood to the sides of the keel using 1" drywall screws (drill some pilot holes for the screws) into the keel.  Drill a hole in each piece of plywood, near the top, only large enough to inject the foam thru.  The only purpose for replacing the junk in the hole with foam is to create a uniform shape to the keel.  The closed-cell foam won't absorb water should water penetrate the fiberglass and other coatings you will apply over the foam. (Jeremy Thompson)  (Back)

 

  1. Floor Replacement

Question:  I'm thinking seriously about replacing the floor in my G30, currently we  have carpet over a plywood sub-floor. Replacements are typically teak &  holly and I don't really understand why. I'm thinking strongly about cedar > as it is fairly resistant to water rot, possibly mahogany or a very durable > laminate flooring.
Any advise on why or why not to do this would be greatly appreciated.

Suggestions:  Teak & holly flooring is hard and doesn't absorb moisture as much as other woods. I am replacing my floor as well and I went with marine grade ribbon mahogany. The mahogany cost around $60 where the teak & holly would have been over $200. Lots of paint or varnish will seal the wood and should give  you a good floor. I'm putting about 10 coats of Wood Mate on my floor. I have 6 coats on now and you can see your reflection. The previous owner put in normal finished grade painted plywood as a floor and it lasted about 4  years before it started to rot & become soft. (Brian Lumley)


I Covered my plywood floor with , that Pergo laminate , I wanted a light colour on the wood with some durability , It worked out somewhat o.k. and it stiffened the floor making it solid.
                1 pkg Pergo ( Mine was Light Maple )
                West epoxy

On the base of the Pergo floor it is a waxed plastic , I tried epoxy on it to glue to the plywood but it didn't stick. Sanded off the plastic base then epoxy to plywood, much better.
Once on, cut our to match the plywood , then using a round over router bit , go all the way around, (or ogee bit , which ever you prefer, Note you will be removing the Pergo laminate , which leaves the MDF ( I believe ) exposed. Do all your screw holes , then apply West epoxy to seal all exposed MDF.

More of a decorative nature I put 4 bras screws in each plank which also secured it the plywood. Once finished screw back down. Use the same method for each of the bilge access ports then put a nice brass flush ring pull on each.

Sore spots : Not tradition teak and holly

After I screwed the floor back in place , for addition installs i.e. bilge pump I have had to lift up the floor which requires removing the screws , when the screw comes up the head catches the laminate and lifts a chunk out from the floor. Re-address the screw holes and find a screw system that can come out with out damage, yet remain flush when installed.

What you need is to install brass V flush inserts , but I am not sure if any body makes them.
Heavy , you've added extra weight. not always a racing thing.

Plus's :     durable
                 easy to clean
                 rot and mildew treatment already applied
                 lots of colours to choose from
                 accessible from local hardware store
                can be done at home , in workshop during winter.       (Paul Guy Lachance)


I Covered my plywood floor with , that Pergo laminate , I wanted a light colour on the wood
On removing the screws , when the screw come up the head catches the laminate and lifts a chuck out from the floor.  What you need is to install brass V flush inserts , but I am not sure if any body makes them but Lee Valley sells brass countersunk washers that may do this job:      (Tim Nye) (Back)


4. Deck Drains

                Having problems with leaking Deck Drains. Here is one solution.

I removed the leaking bronze thru decks, glassed over the deck drains and created scuppers just under the toerail in my Classic 31. seems to be a better leak free result. (Craig Ludwin) (Back


5. Headroom

    Question has been asked whether Headroom in Centreboard G30 is same as in keel version.

    Response seems to be that 'Yes, both have a headroom of  6' 4"' (Back

 

  1. Forestay Fitting Failure

Concern has been expressed by some owners regarding the cast aluminum forestay fitting cracking and giving way with the disastrous results of the mast falling back. There is further discussion on this subject in the Grampian 26 and Grampian 23 FAQ sections.

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For those looking for a good fix, Stainless Outfitters (www.stainlessoutfitters.com) out of Barrie, Ontario are offering a replacement stainless steel fitting. Their "one of" price is around $900 but this could be reduced through multiple orders. $900 may be high but when you consider the cost and possible injury caused by failure of the part, it could represent a low cost. These are photos of their units.

              Click on thumbprint for larger image

      G26/G28                    G30

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  1. Window Replacement

I am new proud owner of G30. My first project will be to fix the large leaky portlight. Does anyone have any experience replacing the window gasket?

http://www.hollandmarine.com/gasketpage.html

Is is difficult job? Does it work? I'm looking for any tips you can give

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I replaced the windows on a G26 using this gasket.  Once you get the hang of it the job goes pretty easily.

First thing is to check the gasket you have.  Holland Marine sells two shapes, and they told me Grampian used both.

If you replace the plastic windows, you need butyl tape or double sided foam tape to stick the window to the inside of the frame.  If I remember correctly, the tape was about 1/16" thick, and I found double sided foam tape (just like what was originally there) for about $5 a roll.  Check with window glass places, and you can probably get the stuff locally for much less than the $21.47 that Holland charges.

I used my thumb, a putty knife and a small screwdriver to work the "hook" edge of the gasket into the frame.  The big trick is going around corners.  The stuff doesn't like to bend tightly at room temperature, but warming it with a hot air gun did the trick.  It didn't have to get too hot to handle with bare hands before it was soft enough to fit the curve.

The other suggestion is to not put any tension on the gasket as you fit it into the frame.  If the gasket is stretched any it eventually creeps back to its original length and pulls away from the corners or pulls in a gap at the joint.  I learned this the hard way, and the fellow I sold the boat to got some gaps (Sorry David!).

The other thing that made the job easier was using a scaffold along side the boat (which was out of the water).  It was a lot easier standing on the scaffold and working at chest level than trying to sit on the side deck. (Tim Nye)

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I too am doing my windows this spring.

Wondered about foam vs buyl tape.. was wondering if the foam tape you get from CDN Tire etc for sealing would be as good? More pressure on the pane, but does it seal any better or worse? As you say you can get a roll or two of that for $15 to do the whole boat as opposed to $21 whatever.. I think you need 2 rolls for a 26. I am doing all the windows.

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I used the butyl tape as a temp fix 'till I rebed them. the advantage is that it is removable and i dont know if that foam is. i would use caution if the foam is perm, as you may need to perform another operation in the future. I used silicone and it is holding up like a charm. (Quinn  McColly)



 

 

 

 

       

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